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Old 01-16-2012, 08:05 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Polaris Classic Stall/Backfire??

I am having alittle trouble with something. Sled starts and runs fantastic however after all warmed up and ridden alittle it is haveing a problem when you let the motor fall below 4000 RPM. Once you let the throttle off and the motor slows it will try to stall when you reapply the throttle? It will also backfire however if you really slowly feather the thottle through it will regain power and keep going. Also if just keep the engine running at 4000 rpm the no problems at all. I was thinking bad gas or gummed up carbs anybody have any info??? Thanks in advance.
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Old 01-16-2012, 08:19 AM   #2 (permalink)
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It sounds electrical to me.Plugs,wires and caps are all ok?
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Old 01-16-2012, 08:54 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I replaced the plugs already (assuming the same) The old plugs were not fouled. Wires and caps look alright. I'll fire it up at night to see if there is any arking.
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Old 01-16-2012, 09:12 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Did you unscrew the caps from the wires and check for corrosion.
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Old 01-16-2012, 09:15 AM   #5 (permalink)
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No , all I've done so far is replace the plugs, add a bottle of dry gas to the fuel. I will check the caps tonight. Thanks for your help
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Old 01-16-2012, 11:26 AM   #6 (permalink)
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If it won't idle, that usually points to a carb problem.
Most often it is either a clogged pilot or a stuck choke that is the culprit.
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Old 01-16-2012, 11:32 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ Gleason View Post
If it won't idle, that usually points to a carb problem.
Most often it is either a clogged pilot or a stuck choke that is the culprit.
RJ its idling fine but when you give it throttle to take off it starts to die off at 4000 rpm. If you let go of the throddle when its starts to sputter it will go back to idle and wont stall. Its only when your trying to give it gas. Also anything above 4000 it runs fine.
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Old 01-16-2012, 11:40 AM   #8 (permalink)
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So just to comfirm,,,,, the clutches are not engaged when this is happening.


if the clutches are engaged than your secondary or primary may not be back shifting ( have worn or dirty parts)
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Old 01-19-2012, 07:32 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I believe I've narrowed it down to being an electrical issue. As explained by a friend the sled reaches RPM's that would cause the clutch to engage at that point there is an electrical failure causing it to lose spark. The cylinder then loads up with fuel then spark returns causing the backfire..... This theary sounds logical however I still don't know where to start. Anybody have any input?? My plan as of now is to start at the plug caps wires and coils and start working back.
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Old 01-19-2012, 07:44 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Inline spark detectors will indicate if that is happening.
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Old 01-19-2012, 08:00 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Buy Lisle Inline Spark TE LIS20610 at Advance Auto Parts

you mean this? Do I run it on one cylinder while testing the other? Not sure if it would work that way but for $16 I'll give it a shot.
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Old 01-19-2012, 08:18 AM   #12 (permalink)
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While the theory sounds like it has merit, the nagging question in my mind is "Why would reaching 4000RPM cause an electrical issue that would then go away when I get the motor to rev up beyond that speed"?

There's a variety of things that come into my mind as places to look for issues...

First, I would look very closely at the carbs. Even if you've already done so, pull them and clean them very thoroughly. The idle circuit may have a clogged jet or passageway that will cause serious bogging issues (wants to die when you hit the throttle coming off of idle).

Bad gas will do this too. Exactly how old is the fuel that's in it? I drove my wife's sled the other day for the first time in a month or so. The fuel that was in it was 87 Octane (with stabilizer) that was probably 60 days old. It ran horrid until that fuel was displaced by the 93 Octane (fresh) that I had just dumped into the tank (which was mostly empty). The symptoms were exactly the same as the problems I had tracked down and fixed that were all relative to a bog off of idle.

Dumb question: Have you checked the fuel shutoff to make sure that it's on and functioning properly? If I turn mine off, my sled will idle fine all day (I don't understand why it doesn't completely turn the fuel supply off, but ...) but it won't rev up correctly.

How's the fuel pump? You may want to pull it apart and check all of the diaphragms very carefully for any holes. Maybe just rebuild it...

If your clutch is engaging at 4000RPM, you should be looking at the primary clutch. I have two Classic 500's (a 97 Classic Touring and a 98 Classic) that both engage in the higher 4k range. You may have a worn spring in the primary that is robbing the motor of power. This would be something that would most likely be seen if the motor revs up to 4000 without issue and THEN bogs out as the clutch is engaging.

Check the plug boots to be sure they're making contact good. Remove them from the plug and press them back on slowly. You should feel a positive "click" when they engage the plug.

What do the plugs look like? Are they the right ones for the motor? Are they both showing the same color / condition?

You could have a bad needle / seat in the carb which could cause the motor to flood from delivery of too much fuel. A bad or incorrectly adjusted float arm could do the same thing as could bowl floats that don't slide smoothly in the bowl.

I believe that this issue is with your new purchase, the 2001 600 Classic Touring... Correct? That's a flat-slide carb'ed motor with VES. So, there are some additional areas to check things out...
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Old 01-19-2012, 08:33 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I'm with you on the bad fuel thing, I don't know how old the gas is or what octane.

The old plugs I replaced were dry and dark brown. Doesn't appear to be flooding.

I checked the plug caps, I removed them from the coil and put them back on slowly, no obvious sign of problem and they click down over the plugs properly.

I haven't checked the fuel pump yet.

The thing is its not a bog its a complete shut down and always happens at the same RPM.
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Old 01-19-2012, 08:37 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Un-screw the carb top and make sure the jet needle is clean and hasn't got some buildup on it.
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Old 01-19-2012, 08:41 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Where does the clutch engage relative to the issue? Before, AT, or after?

If it's AT, you should check the primary, secondary, chain, chaincase gears, and so on through the drive train.

What happens if you put the back end in the air, remove the belt, and spin the track? Is it smooth and "easy"? Or, do you have to really hang on it to get it to move?
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Old 01-19-2012, 08:53 AM   #16 (permalink)
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What do you mean by AT?

The problem occurs before the clutch engages. Heres a run through

Start from cold (no problems) let it warm up give it gas slowly it will start to die at 4000 exactly. Push throttle through very very slowly clutch will engage machine takes off no problems above 4000 RPM, come into a corner slow down with brake but keep on the throttle to keep it above 4000 runs smooth through the corner / stop etc. If you let off throttle and try to come back on the motor dies. If you reapply the throttle very slowly it will sputter alittle then come back to life. If you try to give normal throttle it will back fire / stall. If at anytime you completly let off the throttle it will go back to idle like nothings wrong.


I will put it up in the air tonight and try that
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Old 01-19-2012, 09:13 AM   #17 (permalink)
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I was wondering if the motor issue was occurring AT clutch engagement, but it's happening before.

Since the issue happens before the drive train becomes part of the equation, checking the track like I suggested will likely not yield anything that pertains to this issue.

Since it happens at the exact same motor speed every time, regardless of what else is going on, how about a TPS issue?
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Old 01-19-2012, 09:34 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Tps ???
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Old 01-19-2012, 09:37 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Throttle Position Sensor

You could literally have a problem with the throttle control itself, the wiring, or anything within the magneto where the TPS comes into play.
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Old 01-19-2012, 09:39 AM   #20 (permalink)
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There could also be an issue with the sensor (located on the mag side carb) that's tied in to the TPS.
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