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Old 02-07-2008, 03:11 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Wind Chill vs machinery

I just thought I would post this here because about 3 or 4 times a year every winter I get into it with someone I know. This is from Alaska Science Forum.edu Most reference to wind chill is against human bare skin.

Wind Chill vs Machinery

If we were to take an engine block and install it on mounts in the middle of a field for the winter, it would make no difference in the temperature of that engine block if the wind blew or not. It would remain at the ambient temperature of the air surrounding it, whether or not the air was moving. However, if we were to start up that engine and let it warm up, there would be a great deal of difference in the block temperature depending on whether or not the wind was blowing.

Any object that creates its own internal heat will find that heat is removed from it faster if the air around it is moving. It is simply a matter of heat transfer--the "conveyor belt" of moving air (convection) will snatch the heat away much faster than if it were still.

So the answer to the question is yes. Wind chill does affect machines, but only if they are at a temperature above that of the surrounding air.

So if the piece of machinery is warm the wind will cause it to cool down faster, but it would not cool it anymore than the ambient temperature of the surrounding air. Once it reaches that temperature there is no wind chill on a piece of machinery.
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Old 02-07-2008, 03:27 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I would think that it would run better provided it was jetted right only makes sence to me cooler motor= more hp
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Old 02-07-2008, 03:57 PM   #3 (permalink)
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my question would be...if it were -5 below, with a wind of 15 MPH in your face, and you ride your sled at 50mph directly into the wind, what would the wind chill be?
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Old 02-07-2008, 04:00 PM   #4 (permalink)
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The same as if it was -15 and a 65mph wind.
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Old 02-07-2008, 05:38 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I disagree to some extent. I agree that the engine will cool down, but wind chill is a feeling that only warm blooded animals feel. An engine does not feel if it's hot or cold. The only reason we talk about wind chill is because it effects us.

I've had the same argument. I work on steel bridges and one of the QA guys said it was to cold (with the wind chill) to do some work and I argued that the wind chill does not affect the steel. With you example, you have a point that it's heated by combustion, but I was dealing with a steel beam.
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Old 02-07-2008, 06:00 PM   #6 (permalink)
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yeah, but he's saying that the wind only will help cool an object down quicker. it will not cool it below the current air temp but it will cool it faster. it would have no effect on a peice of steel.

for example= a cup of hot coffee, or chocolate. it's too hot to drink, so you can blow on it. the wind will make the liquid reduce it's temperature quicker than sitting without blowing on it. once it reaches room temp, however, you can blow on it all you want and it will not make it any cooler.
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Old 02-07-2008, 09:04 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Perfect explanation, JKSled. I agree 100%.
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Old 02-07-2008, 09:24 PM   #8 (permalink)
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That's the whole theory on fan cooled engines!!
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Old 02-07-2008, 11:02 PM   #9 (permalink)
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That's a great explanation. Can a fan cooled engine run too cool? Will it not produce as much power if it is cooler than optimal?
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Old 02-08-2008, 07:41 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I think if the engine is too cool it will not run as good as it was designed to run. All the metals in an engine expand when they get warm the aluminum pistons expand at a different rate than the steel cylinders, so the engine when warmed up to the proper temp makes it so all the clearances are optimal. I know air cooled engines seem to run best when it is really cold out, but I think that has to do with the fact that they are running a little leaner also.
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Old 02-08-2008, 11:47 AM   #11 (permalink)
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You're right erik. A lot of weather forcasts and such use the term "feels like" when listing wind chill factors. When you go outside and its 5 degrees but with a wind chill of -45, your body is going to cool down as if it were -45 outside. Wind chills effectively "pull the heat away from you" as if the ambient air temp was that cold, it won't cool you to -45.
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Old 02-08-2008, 11:53 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
You're right erik. A lot of weather forcasts and such use the term "feels like" when listing wind chill factors. When you go outside and its 5 degrees but with a wind chill of -45, your body is going to cool down as if it were -45 outside. Wind chills effectively "pull the heat away from you" as if the ambient air temp was that cold, it won't cool you to -45.
^ now that makes sence
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Old 02-08-2008, 03:35 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jKsled
yeah, but he's saying that the wind only will help cool an object down quicker. it will not cool it below the current air temp but it will cool it faster. it would have no effect on a peice of steel.

for example= a cup of hot coffee, or chocolate. it's too hot to drink, so you can blow on it. the wind will make the liquid reduce it's temperature quicker than sitting without blowing on it. once it reaches room temp, however, you can blow on it all you want and it will not make it any cooler.
I understand that. But the term "wind chill" in not the correct term to use. As I said before wind chill happens to warm blooded animals. From Wikipedia:

Wind chill is the apparent temperature felt on exposed skin, which is a function of the air temperature and wind speed. The wind chill temperature (often popularly called the wind chill factor) is always lower than the air temperature, except at higher temperatures where wind chill is considered less important. In cases where the apparent temperature is higher than the air temperature, the heat index is used instead.
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Old 02-08-2008, 03:39 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Here is another definition:

The temperature of windless air that would have the same effect on exposed human skin as a given combination of wind speed and air temperature.
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Old 02-08-2008, 03:41 PM   #15 (permalink)
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And another:

What is a wind chill factor?

Well, it's how much colder humans feel when there's a breeze or wind. I'm sure you've noticed that you feel colder when the wind is blowing on a winter day. When you get out of the wind, you aren't as cold.

The interesting thing is that the wind chill factor doesn't have any effect on stuff like water -- just on people. So, if the wind chill factor is 25 º F (or - 3.89º C) water won't freeze! Cool, huh?
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Old 02-08-2008, 07:51 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptrapper65
I understand that. But the term "wind chill" in not the correct term to use. As I said before wind chill happens to warm blooded animals. From Wikipedia:

Wind chill is the apparent temperature felt on exposed skin, which is a function of the air temperature and wind speed. The wind chill temperature (often popularly called the wind chill factor) is always lower than the air temperature, except at higher temperatures where wind chill is considered less important. In cases where the apparent temperature is higher than the air temperature, the heat index is used instead.
i know that the "wind chill" applies specifically to us, like you said, but it's just the exact same principal. both are warm objects, and wind causes them to cool faster, or make it feel like it's colder to us.
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Old 02-08-2008, 09:00 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Fun Fact - My sister just told me that her boyfriend was saying Windshield instead of wind chill. and he explained it as the the tempature your frot windoew would be while driving. LMAO. I cant believe that.

Anyway. great thread. Good read. my opinion changed several times reading threw it.
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Old 02-09-2008, 09:09 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jKsled
i know that the "wind chill" applies specifically to us, like you said, but it's just the exact same principal. both are warm objects, and wind causes them to cool faster, or make it feel like it's colder to us.
Correct, but it should only be called wind chill when refering to warm blooded animals that feel it. It's called thermodynamics when refering to other stuff. My whole point was that word "wind chill" was being used wrong. It's the same as when people say "cement truck" when refering to a concrete truck, or when they say "motor" when refering to and engine. Get it?
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Old 02-09-2008, 11:06 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptrapper65
Correct, but it should only be called wind chill when refering to warm blooded animals that feel it. It's called thermodynamics when refering to other stuff. My whole point was that word "wind chill" was being used wrong. It's the same as when people say "cement truck" when refering to a concrete truck, or when they say "motor" when refering to and engine. Get it?
Heat transfer.
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Old 02-09-2008, 12:32 PM   #20 (permalink)
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But everyone calls it the wind chill factor.
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